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Memory Alpha:Category suggestion archive

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[edit] Vote on the procedure to vote on categories

Please sign in the appropriate subsection if you agree or disagree. If you disagree, give a reason. If, after 5 days, there's no unresolved disagreement and at least three people agree, this procedure should be considered accepted.

Procedure accepted after 5 days. -- Cid Highwind 00:21, 2004 Dec 28 (CET)

[edit] Agree

  • Cid Highwind 23:08, 22 Dec 2004 (CET)
  • Mike, Kobi and EtaPiscium already supported some of the categories suggested below - I'd like to count that as an implicit agreement to this suggestion to get things started. Let me know if this is incorrect. -- Cid Highwind 12:32, 2004 Dec 26 (CET)

[edit] Disagree

Category votes now occur on subpages to Memory Alpha:Category tree.

[edit] Archived suggestions

[edit] Nonhumans

Since we have a list page called Individuals, why not make category:Nonhumans to encompass those, and all other individuals that don't fit into Category:Romulans, Category:Humans, Category:Klingons, et al? I'd image it would get quite large, but we could always splinter the Delta Quad individuals from the rest. --Alan del Beccio 21:04, 27 Aug 2005 (UTC)

  • Before I vote on this, are you saying the Nonhumans would not include those species who already have their own categories, i.e. Romulans and Klingons? I'm not sure if that would be right, since those races are nonhumans, after all. Then again, that would make it extremely large. Hmmm... --From Andoria with Love 06:43, 28 Aug 2005 (UTC)

Shouldn't this be Category:Aliens or something similarly neutral? "Nonhumans" misleadingly gives the impression that it covers everything which isn't human, rather than what you said above. Makon 01:58, 8 Oct 2005 (UTC)

  • While "nonhumans" does sound kinda messy, Aliens wouldn't really be right either as it could be taken as "Category:Species", and it's not from the POV I think we want. Although I agree new suggestions are probably needed. - AJHalliwell 02:09, 8 Oct 2005 (UTC)
  • I don't think it is at all misleading, and is, in fact, quite clear in the way it is laid out. All other "non-humans" that do not belong to the sub-categories listed on the adjacent page would go in the list. --Alan del Beccio 03:24, 8 Oct 2005 (UTC)

[edit] Starting point category

Category:Memory Alpha or Category:Articles

I have noticed that this site doesn't have one yet, so I am proposing a category that would be a starting point for locating any article. It's subcategories would obviously be Category:Star Trek and Category:Memory Alpha maintenance. Adamwankenobi 21:30, 13 August 2006 (UTC)

Maybe I am missing something, but what would the point of having these categories be? Category:Memory Alpha would apply to EVERYTHING on MA, and seems pointless to me, and pretty much so would Category:Articles. As for having a starting point, that is what those lists and stuff on the main page are for. --OuroborosCobra talk 21:35, 13 August 2006 (UTC)

You're exactly right. The proposed new category would apply to EVERYTHING, therefore this site would be taking its first step in the right direction of cleaning up its messy categorization system. What troubles me is that the current categorization system has no real starting point. Yeah, you could say the main page serves as this but that's the responsibility of the categories—to point readers in the right direction. If we were to take this action, ONE link on the main page would suffice. The link would then point to the proposed all-encompassing category and everybody would be happy. :) Adamwankenobi 01:14, 14 August 2006 (UTC)

Personnally, I would rather see the main page as a jumping point than to see every article get acategory added on (some already have too many). Given that, and that I feel I know understand what these categories would be (although I still do not know the difference between Category:Memory Alpha and Category:Articles), I have to vote oppose. --OuroborosCobra talk 01:34, 14 August 2006 (UTC)

I don't think you fully understand what I mean. The category wouldn't be applied to every article, it would be applied to TWO CATEGORIES. And those two categories would be Category:Star Trek and Category:Memory Alpha maintenance. I tried to make that clear in my initial request. It's just a simple housekeeping maneuver. Adamwankenobi 02:05, 14 August 2006 (UTC)

Still opposing. --OuroborosCobra talk 02:16, 14 August 2006 (UTC)

You shouldn't be asking yourself "Why?", but rather, "Why not?". I don't understand your ground for opposing. I can't see what this category would hurt. Adamwankenobi 02:34, 14 August 2006 (UTC)

Read my initial vote, I include multiple "why nots" --OuroborosCobra talk 02:47, 14 August 2006 (UTC)
comment I've seen wikis with a category "AtoZ" that allows them to control the index, unlike Special:Allpages, which lists every page and doesn't allow you to control it. It also allows you to add sort keys. Maybe that is what the articles category would be here. --Bp 02:51, 14 August 2006 (UTC)
Well, there already are "starting point categories" for two of the three basic page types we have (1.in-universe articles, 2.PPOV articles, 3.Project pages), and (as I already stated in one of the related discussions) I'm not sure if a single "starting point" even makes sense for the third type. Since we're trying to keep the different page types separate anyway, I don't see the point in tying them together by another top-level category. Why would anyone need a connected chain of categories from, for example, an in-universe article to a policy page? -- Cid Highwind 12:21, 14 August 2006 (UTC)
I wasn't aware our categorizating system was in need of a clean-up. Nor are these categories really necessary, IMO. Oppose. --From Andoria with Love 12:28, 14 August 2006 (UTC)
  • Archived -- I think the votes speak for themselves. --Alan del Beccio 23:37, 10 September 2006 (UTC)

[edit] Television Category

We there should be a Category: Television Series or similar to collect together the existing Category: Episodes, and to place the master article for each series. Drhaggis 22:07, 22 Jan 2005 (CET)

Isn't Category:Episodes exactly what you are describing? It contains the 6 "series subcategories" and could contain additional information about "episodes" in general... -- Cid Highwind 23:47, 2005 Jan 22 (CET)

I'm thinking more like

  • Undetermined "Top-level Media" Category
    • Television Shows
      • Episodes
    • Movies
    • Books
    • Video Games

TV shows is where we place the episodes category, any lists of episodes, all the articles on the existing tv shows, Info on Star Trek: Phase II, any "list of X episodes" articles. Drhaggis 00:17, 23 Jan 2005 (CET)

What else would the Television Shows category contain, apart from one link to the episodes category? The Media category might be useful, but that is already being discussed in the above section. I don't see the for a Television Shows category, since we already have Category:Episodes. -- Harry 23:48, 23 Jan 2005 (CET)

Where else would we categorize master articles such as Star Trek: Voyager and their ilk? It would also hold any documentaries and specials and allow for a cross-ref with all television list categories. For example "List of XXX episodes" would go in Category: Lists and Category: Television Shows as Wikipedia does it. Is Episodes a top level category? Drhaggis 00:23, 24 Jan 2005 (CET)

Well, in the unnamed category for "out-of-universe" information that I suggested above, I guess? It would contain the "Episodes" category directly; I don't think we need another category layer between these two categories. "Books" (or better yet, "Novels" and "Reference books"?) would be another good subcategory, though. Regarding Wikipedia, keep in mind that Wikipedia is an encyclopedia "about everything", including many television series. Memory Alpha is an encyclopedia about just six - we probably don't need the same level of detail as Wikipedia. Episodes would not be a top level category, but a subcategory of Trek franchise (or whatever name we choose). -- Cid Highwind 21:39, 2005 Jan 27 (CET)

Star Trek: Voyager would be considered "out-of-universe"? Odd. It may actually be easier to determine the lowest level categories first. Once most articles are categorized, forming and changing the tree is less painfull. Do we honestly think that we can "lock" the tree in place on a Wiki? Come to think of it it is less like a tree because several of the smaller nodes will cross. Drhaggis 03:10, 28 Jan 2005 (CET)

Of course... How could an article about a series (movie/novel/...) set in a fictional universe be a part of that universe? The events happening in that series are, but the series itself is not.
Regarding the suggested procedure, I think we are having this discussion page exactly because we know that we can't "lock" the tree completely - but by discussing all ideas first instead of simply implementing any or all of them, we're avoiding much redundant work and categories that simply don't make sense... -- Cid Highwind 12:03, 2005 Jan 28 (CET)
Any further thoughts or should Category:Television series suggestion be archived, voted on or resubmitted? -- Captain Mike K. Bartel 17:43, 16 Mar 2005 (EST)
I vote to archive this discussion - the possible scope of this category in addition to the episode categories we already have is still unclear to me. -- Cid Highwind 08:46, 21 Mar 2005 (EST)

[edit] Category:Non-sentient animals

I think this could be a good category, filled with references to all the non-sentient creatures from Star Trek, such as Spot, Butler and even Picard's Lionfish Livingston (fish). What does anyone else think? zsingaya 15:33, 30 Jan 2005 (CET)

Is this a suggestion for a "list" of individual pets? In that case, I'd suggest another category title, Domestic animals (or Pets, although I'd prefer the former). If it is a category of "animal species", it should be called that, (or "non-sentient species", perhaps) - but in that case, the category shouldn't contain any individual animals... -- Cid Highwind 18:40, 2005 Jan 30 (CET)

Well, there are references to individual animals, perhaps a category showing the different non-sentient animals in Star Trek would be useful, because it could then link to the individual animals. I'm not sure how many official pets were mentioned, off the top of my head, I can only think of Spot, Butler, Picard's fish, Janeway's Dog, Archer's Dog Porthos, although I'm sure there must be more. There must be a way to integrate them with un-named non-sentient species, such as Targ. zsingaya 21:25, 30 Jan 2005 (CET)

The problem is that one category for both "individual animals" and "animal species" would be mixing two completely different concepts - a similar idea would be to have one category for both Worf (a member of one sentient species) and Romulans, Ferengi and Bajorans (other sentient species). Also, I think that "non-sentient animals" would be a redundant title. Aren't animals non-sentient by definition? -- Cid Highwind 22:22, 2005 Jan 30 (CET)
There already is a List of pets and a List of non-sentient lifeforms I'm not sure anything else is needed. Tyrant 22:31, 30 Jan 2005 (CET)Tyrant
OK then, looks like there's no point. Thanks anyway. zsingaya 13:04, 31 Jan 2005 (CET)

A list is not a category. "Pets" might be the most specific name for such a grouping. I vote for a Category: Pets. It would be a sub-category of a larger "animalia" type group I would think. Drhaggis 08:02, 1 Feb 2005 (CET)

Any further thoughts or should these be archived, voted on or resubmitted? -- Captain Mike K. Bartel 17:43, 16 Mar 2005 (EST)

[edit] TREE Suggestion A (Redge)

[edit] Discussion of suggestion A

A problem I have with this tree is the fact that some articles would exist in different subcategories of the same category. Earth, for example, would belong to Locations - Planets - Alpha Quadrant planets and Locations - Space - Federation space.

IMO, it would be preferable to have one category for the "cartographic" structure (Cartography - Alpha&Beta quadrant - Federation space) and another one for the "astronomical" structure (Astronomy - Planet - Homeworld). -- Cid Highwind 16:23, 1 Oct 2004 (CEST)

I think it'd be better to separate "space travel" (starships, starship classes, space stations) from "hardware", and split "science" from "technology", and then just put the hardware with technology, since those two basically cover the same kinds of things. This would avoid a lot of overlap since science and technology aren't the same subjects, and space travel hardware is "technology" by definition anyway. -- EtaPiscium 18:38, 1 Oct 2004 (CEST)

    • I agree that a with those splits. It makes absolute sense to separate science from technology, and then put hardware and spacetravel under that. (Toddas 17:34, 18 Oct 2004 (CEST))

[edit] TREE Suggestion B1 (Cid Highwind)

I suggest the following category tree for planets (see Talk:Stellar Cartography). This could replace the several existing Lists of ___ planets.

  • Locations or Places
    • Planets
      • Uninhabited planets
      • Inhabited planets
        • Homeworlds
      • Federation planets
      • Klingon planets
      • Romulan planets
      • ...

Each planet could then belong to one of the first three subcategories (uninhabited, inhabited, homeworld) plus one of the 'affiliations' (or to category:planets directly, if nothing is known about the planet). -- Cid Highwind 14:37, 6 Sep 2004 (CEST)

I've never liked the "inhabited planets" distinction. At what point is a planet "inhabited"? Does a planet with nothing but an outpost or a starbase where there is only a "semi-permanent" population count as "inhabited"? What about planets that were inhabited but aren't any longer? I think it'd be better if it were just sorted on jurisdiction, i.e. Federation, Klingon, etc. This would also sort planets in a single system together even if one is inhabited and the other is not.
Also, I think calling the categories "planets" is too restrictive. It doesn't include stars, star systems, nebulae, or any other space object that could be considered a "place". I suggest:
  • Stellar Cartography
    • Stars
    • Planets
      • Homeworlds
      • Minor bodies
    • Nebulae
    • Clusters
    • Sectors
    • Other objects
    • Neutral space
    • Federation space
    • Klingon space
    • ...
Each planet, star, star system, nebula, comet, etc could be categorized in one of the first general categories, and then in an additional category for location if applicable -- EtaPiscium 06:36, 25 Sep 2004 (CEST)
XXX space categories are a good suggestion. What exactly does "Planets -> Minor bodies'" mean, though? -- Cid Highwind 11:00, 1 Oct 2004 (CEST)
Minor bodies -- I was thinking moons, planetoids, comets, asteroids, etc. I'm not that comfortable lumping those under "planets" if we can help it. -- EtaPiscium 18:32, 1 Oct 2004 (CEST)
I like this breakdown. It makes a lot of sence and isnt overly broken down. Drhaggis 00:26, 24 Jan 2005 (CET)

[edit] Discussion of suggestion B1

Even now, there are several different suggestions for location categories, for example Alpha Quadrant planets or Federation space. One could think of more, such as Sol sector or even Sol system. Some questions:

  • How detailed should these categories become?
    • X space seems to be a good one, Y sector might be useful in some cases - it should not be created for every sector.
  • How should these categories be arranged?
    • First, I don't like the category X Quadrant planets, for the reasons stated above by EtaPiscium. We should use one "Quadrant" category for everything (additionally, Alpha/Beta should be combined in one category). In that case, should (for example) Federation space be a subcategory of Alpha&Beta quadrant, or should both categories be on the same level? -- Cid Highwind 16:12, 1 Oct 2004 (CEST)

[edit] TREE Suggestion B2 (Cid Highwind)

still incomplete...

  • Astronomy
    • Stars
    • Planets
    • Moons
    • Nebulae
    • Clusters
    • Sectors (Note: A list of sectors. Each sector would go here and to an appropriate subcategory of Stellar Cartography.)
    • ...
  • Stellar Cartography
    • Alpha&Beta quadrant (Note: Should be combined. We often don't know the correct quadrant exactly.)
      • Federation space
      • Klingon space
      • Romulan space
      • ...
    • Gamma quadrant
      • ...
    • Delta quadrant
      • ...

[edit] Discussion of suggestion B2

This incomplete suggestion avoids the problem I see with suggestion A. Each object (planet, moon, ...) would appear once in an "Astronomy" subcategory and once in a "Cartography" subcategory. I will add more later. -- Cid Highwind 16:36, 1 Oct 2004 (CEST)

I'd recommend just having "homeworlds" under "planets", and then putting all other planets under the general "planets" category. This avoids the semantics of "what constitutes a colony" vs outposts, settlements, camps, multiple colonies, former colonies, etc. If necessary, the names of actual colonies themselves could be put in another category under "Planets", like "Locations", which could also include cities, land-forms, provinces, etc. -- EtaPiscium 18:44, 1 Oct 2004 (CEST)

I don't think that city, province, colony etc. would be valid sub-categories of planet. All those are "has a" relations ("planet has a city"), but what we should try to create (IMO) are "is a" relations ("homeworld is a planet"). As such, colony world would still be a valid category, and I think also an important one, because there are _many_ colony worlds... -- Cid Highwind 15:50, 4 Oct 2004 (CEST)
Well, would "colony world" be articles about the colony itself, or about the planet that the colony is on? I think that in many cases it's difficult to determine whether a planet counts as a "colony world". Are we including all planets that were colonized at some point? Or just all planets that currently have a "colony" (with all the terminology pitfalls I mentioned before)?
Also, I think the whole "colony" article vs. "colony world" article is something that still needs to be clarified. If it was the actual name of the colony itself and not the planet, then I think it qualifies in the same category as a city since most colonies become cities anyway when the planet gets to a certain level of development. -- EtaPiscium 19:40, 4 Oct 2004 (CEST)
OK, I removed "colony world" from my suggestion - this as well as the "(un)inhabited planets" can continue to exist as a list. Further comments? -- Cid Highwind 23:19, 22 Dec 2004 (CET)
I like this format; it limits the possible categories that anything astronomical might fall into, and the categories are very clear so there'll be only a few cases where a something's placement might be debated. I agree that additional groupings such as "homeworld" can exist in their current list form. -- EtaPiscium 09:33, 23 Dec 2004 (CET)
Thanks for your reply. Regarding subgroupings as lists, I think any such list article should be placed in the category as well. We can use "sort keys" to include those at the top of the list, for example: [[Category:Planets| List of Homeworlds]] (note the leading blank)... Further comments/objections? Anyone? -- Cid Highwind 10:45, 23 Dec 2004 (CET)
Technically, any article (or category) can be in any number of categories, according to Mediawiki's categorization. Hence, it is technically a graph, not a tree. So Andoria could be in Category:Founding Members of the United Federation of Planets and Category:Planets. Dma 02:16, 2 Jan 2005 (CET)
Well, the goal of this whole discussion is to find out what "makes sense", not "what's possible" - of course, each article might appear in several categories, but which categories (and connections between categories) are really useful. You theoretical example Category:Founding Members of the United Federation of Planets, for example, isn't a good category because it is too limited - a navigational template would be the better choice here. -- Cid Highwind 02:22, 2005 Jan 2 (CET)

[edit] TREE Suggestion C (Steve)

Well, I'm resurrecting this dinosaur with a pseudo-suggestion. Back in the days when I was a contributor to the abortive Star Trek Novel Encyclopedia Project, I developed a list of categories that I never got around to proposing to the group. Obviously they need refinement because of what MA covers vs. what STNE covered, but here they are:

  • Characters (with MA's in-universe perspective, this way of organizing characters is probably not the way to go)
    • Main Characters
    • Recurring Characters
    • Guest Characters
    • Mentioned Characters
  • Life Forms
    • Contemporary Species
    • Noncorporeal Species
    • Ancient Species
    • Nonsentient Species
      • Animals
      • Plants
      • etc.
  • Society and Culture
    • Organizations (this could range from the Federation to the Lollipop Guild)
    • Language (including alien terms, perhaps)
    • Laws and Rituals
    • Food and Beverages
    • Religion and Philosophy
    • Books
    • Other Arts
    • History
    • Recreation
  • Science and Technology
    • Theories and Principles
    • Energy and Radiation
    • Space-Time
    • Physics and Chemistry
    • Medicine and Xenobiology
    • Military Technology
    • Computers and Communications
    • Propulsion and Transportation
    • Other Machines and Devices
  • Space Travel
    • Spaceships
    • Spaceship types
    • Space stations
    • Other vehicles
  • Stellar Cartography
    • Regions
    • Nebulae
    • Stars
    • Planets
      • Locations
    • Subplanetary objects
    • Other phenomena

Obviously a lot of these could be further subdivided. -- Steve 23:16, 15 Dec 2004 (CET)

[edit] Real People (9-8-05)

Not the most elegant-sounding category, but how about something to the extent of Category:Real people listing people mentioned or seen in Star Trek but who existed in real life and are not merely fictional characters, such as Leonardo da Vinci, Samuel Clemens, Amelia Earhart, and Stephen Hawking?--T smitts 03:20, 28 Aug 2005 (UTC)

  • The thing is, the perspective is outside looking in...since M/A is written in the Star Trek universe POV, they are all technically "real", unless they were created on the holodeck or come from a novel (ie Dixon Hill). --Alan del Beccio 03:42, 28 Aug 2005 (UTC)
    • I can understand that. However by that logic, we really shouldn't have entries for episodes, series, movies, actors, writers, etc., should we? Nor should we have categories for things like performers for each series, as we do.--T smitts 06:56, 28 Aug 2005 (UTC)
  • I Support the idea, but the name definitely needs anew. - AJHalliwell 06:42, 28 Aug 2005 (UTC)
    • I agree. I would like to see something like this but with a better name.--T smitts 07:12, 28 Aug 2005 (UTC)
  • Aren't these people already in the Humans category? Anyway, it should be something like Category:Historical Earth figures or something along those lines, as all characters here are "real" from M/A's POV. Actually, that might not work either, since the likes of James T. Kirk, Richard Daystrom, and even Khan Noonien Singh can also be considered historical Earth figures. Truth-be-told, I'm not sure how such a category could work here, and until a way is found, I'm afraid I must Oppose the suggestion. Not a strong oppose, mind you, but an oppose nonetheless. --From Andoria with Love 06:52, 28 Aug 2005 (UTC)
  • RE:T smitts. Well there is obviously a line between what is in and what is out...and production stuff: episodes, actors, etc fit into that, but making lists from the outside looking in crosses that line. It goes into that whole issue we had with the creation of the Judaism page and filling it with the outside influences of Judaism to Trek. --Alan del Beccio 07:24, 28 Aug 2005 (UTC)
  • Hm, good points have convinced me to re-think this, especially the note of POV. - AJHalliwell 07:31, 28 Aug 2005 (UTC)
  • Somehow, I had a feeling this would be the response this category suggestion would get. I still think it would be a good idea but oh well. Whatever.--T smitts 07:35, 28 Aug 2005 (UTC)
  • I'm not saying I'm against it, I'm just saying we need to fomulate a way to do this. I mean, these individuals already belong to Category:Humans -- creating a "Real humans" type category to stack these individuals in would be horribly redundant. Why not just create a list of those people as a reference, similar to those POV articles based on multi-appearance characters and actors. --Alan del Beccio 07:54, 28 Aug 2005 (UTC)
    • I'm not quite sure what you mean, but maybe someone can explain it to me. (Don't bother trying to now, it's too late where I am right now for anything to sink in.)--T smitts 08:04, 28 Aug 2005 (UTC)
  • I agree with what was said (re:POV) - oppose, unless someone finds a really good category title. -- Cid Highwind 23:24, 1 Sep 2005 (UTC)

[edit] Storyline categories for episodes (Alison9)

(Moved from single suggestion for Category:Episodes)

This is all very linear. I would like to see episodes categorized by other means as well. For instance, primary storyline. A possible tree for this could be:

Culture

  • Federation
    • Human
    • Vulcan
    • Trill
    • Betazoid
  • Bajoran
  • Klingon
  • Romulan
  • Ferengi
  • Borg
  • Dominion
  • Cardassian

Storyline

  • Medical
  • First Contact
  • Character Death
  • Romance
  • War

Alison9 08:36, Jan 13, 2005 (CET)

[edit] Comments

I see some problems with this suggestion. First, we would have to find other category names - Category:Klingon might be a good category for "everything Klingon", and I think we shouldn't use a category for both "in-universe" and "meta-trek" articles at the same time. Second, there are many episodes that could be categorized in several of those categories - do we really want that, how would a "Category:Romantic episodes" be useful? Third, some of this information already exists - if an episode presents important information about Klingon culture, for example, it most likely is alread listed on Klingon or one of the Klingon subpages. -- Cid Highwind 09:35, 2005 Jan 13 (CET)

Could you define meta-trek? If an episode is a first contact medical I don't see how multi-categories is harmful. Wikipedia does it and gives a lot of value added, IMHO. To me the purpose of an encyclopedia is to help people find things. It's all well and good to find them in order, but I find myself wanting to go back and see certain storylines. Today I'm all about Kira/Odo, but three weeks from now I might want Janeway/Chakotay. As for your last point, given your example, do you think the culture categories aleady exist as entries and therefore should be taken away from the suggested tree? I actually think there is a more fundamental issue here. The category conversation seems to be driven by what is too much work and what isn't as opposed to long term gain. I think that might stem from not wanting to have incomplete information live. I think that can be solved by just deciding on a convention and then letting people create the proposed categories at will. That would mean I would create Category: Romantic episodes - Kira/Odo, Category: Romantic episodes - Jadzia Dax/Worf. The character names would be listed alphabetically but not every couple would have to be listed at once, contributors could add cannon couples as they were interested. Would that be a reasonabnle compromise? Alison9 09:57, Jan 13, 2005 (CET)

"Meta-Trek" is a term we inofficially use for articles that aren't part of the Trek-universe itself. Generally, articles about "Trek items" (characters, planets, starships, ...) should be written as if they really exist (in-universe point of view). This leaves articles about Star Trek as a franchise, including episode summaries, articles about actors, directors, novels, video games etc. These are two separate classes of articles, and we try to avoid mixing those two as far as possible. As mentioned above, a "Category:Klingon" should contain Klingon people, Klingon ships and Klingon weapons, but not episodes about Klingons. Regarding your suggestion, I think that a "List of ..." article would be a much better choice in this case. In my opinion, a category is a good choice if more member articles could be added later (a "Jadzia/Worf romance" category would be pretty much finalized right now), if many editors might be willing to contribute to that category and/or if an article can't be categorized in several categories on the "same level" in a category tree at the same time. -- Cid Highwind 11:42, 2005 Jan 13 (CET)


[edit] People by century (11-07-05)

I suggest categorizing various people (all members of a sentient species) by the century in which they lived. When near completed, it would be a pretty large category. The Categories would be:

and perhaps even a Category:Alternate timeline people to categorize any articles on people seen in alternate timelines/alternate universes (not alternate versions of a regular universe character) with a possible subcategory being Category:Mirror universe people (although that might take away from the Mirror universe category).--Tim Thomason 19:31, 5 Oct 2005 (UTC)

The problem with this (I brought this up several times already in response to similar suggestions) is that a too fine subcategorization scheme makes the whole thing too noisy - we would end up with so many categories for each article, that, while the category page might be a nice listing of articles, the equally important category listing on the article page would be humongous and nearly useless. Take Picard for example, he would appear in Distant Past, Early History, 21st Century, 24th Century and Future if I'm not missing anything - combine that with the already existing bunch of "XXX personnel" and other people categories, add some other potential or already-suggested subcategories, shake thoroughly, and you might end up with well over 20 categories or more for some of the main articles. Because of that, I don't agree with this suggestion - what about a collection of good, old lists instead? :) -- Cid Highwind 20:00, 5 Oct 2005 (UTC)
I noticed that many Wikipedia articles have "YYYY births" and "YYYY deaths" categories, I find those very useful, and while not feasible in Memory Alpha, I figured something along the lines of 23d century people, etc. would be equally useful. I should have also stipulated that I don't think little time travel adventures should count at which century they are from. So, Picard would just be 24th century, Kirk just 23rd, McCoy and Spock would be 23rd and 24th, April would be 22nd and 23rd, and T'Pol would be 21st and 22nd. I think these categories, if accepted, would be one of the main and easiest-to-use categories and would apply to virtually every person category on Memory Alpha. This doesn't seem to be very feasible as a list (unlike, say, Category:Starbases or Category:Episodes, or virtually any of the categories that I have suggested above). I personally feel this is one of the more "broader" categories, but, oh well.--Tim Thomason 22:30, 5 Oct 2005 (UTC)
  • Oppose, I don't see a reason for this. We've got year ref.'s on almost every page as is. - AJHalliwell 20:35, 8 Oct 2005 (UTC)

[edit] Production-named species (11-07/05)

Hope this is the right place and way to suggest this. I think it would be useful to have a category of such species because it would make it easier to identify which aliens' names come from episodes and which were only named in production notes (Efrosians, Zaranites, etc).--StAkAr Karnak 14:21, 10 Oct 2005 (UTC)

  • Oppose: This category would be in the wrong POV, and I don't think that is really allowed. Perhaps, a list would be allowed?--Tim Thomason 06:53, 19 Oct 2005 (UTC)
  • Mild Oppose: I agree with Tim; I think a list would be best in this case, plus I'm not entirely sure there's enough to justify its own category. However, I'm not sure how it would be in the wrong POV, since we already have Category:Performers, Category:Directors, and the like. --From Andoria with Love 05:00, 4 Nov 2005 (UTC)
    • Comment: What I meant on the wrong-POV, is that on the canon articles, as opposed to Franchise articles, I don't think there should be a group of production-related categories on an article like that, the same reason we don't categorize all of the Performers as Humans, even though they are. (unsigned by User:Tim Thomason)
  • Archived --Alan del Beccio 08:11, 7 Nov 2005 (UTC)

[edit] Starfleet ranks (11-07-05)

With Category:Starfleet captains already around, I think that maybe they should have categories for all of the ranks. The pages for Starfleet commanders, Starfleet lieutenants, and Starfleet ensigns are already categorized into the "nonexistant" categories (albeit erroneously).

and maybe even Category:Starfleet civilian personnel to cover all probable civilians working on Starfleet ships and at Starfleet bases (Boothby, Mot, etc.).--Tim Thomason 12:57, 28 Sep 2005 (UTC)

I Oppose cat's for Lieutenants, Ensigns, Commander, Admirals, etc. Captain's is iffy even, cause as ranking goes, people get promoted. Technically, if there was an admiral, we could assume they were a lieutenant, a lieutenant (JG) an ensign, a captain, a commander; numerous references that aren't really necessary. Enlisted I support though. - AJHalliwell 22:21, 29 Sep 2005 (UTC)
I understand what you're saying, but we shouldn't assume like that. Most Admirals have never been seen or referred to as any of the ranks, and according to my suggestion (I didn't make this clear) only people either seen with the rank, in the proper timeline, or mentioned with the rank (Picard was a lieutenant when...' etc.) would be categorized. That would shorten it up compared to what you're suggesting. None of the admirals are categorized as Captain, except a couple who were seen as captains. Also, I don't see any problem with an Admiral category, compared to the others.--Tim Thomason 19:40, 1 Oct 2005 (UTC)
I agree with AJ - because it sort of breaks Memory Alpha's typical point of view, because we'd still end up with some articles categorized in several categories and because, apparently, the existing category for starfleet captains hasn't gone through this approval process (or has it? its talk page is empty). Oppose and either remove the starfleet captain category or, perhaps, rework it into a Category:Captains for all characters that captained a ship (not restricted to Starfleet)

[edit] sorting stubs

[edit] Category:Memory Alpha production stubs

There has been a suggestion that we sort the articles in Category:Memory Alpha stubs into subcategories, such as Category:Memory Alpha production stubs, etc, ..

Please register support, opposition or comments for creating that subcategory here.

  • Support -- Captain Mike K. Barteltalk
  • Oppose - see below. -- Cid Highwind 13:10, 9 Dec 2005 (UTC)
  • Comment. Is this totally necessary? It's not like Wikipedia where obscure subjects and topics need someone who understands the content or whatever, and we also don't have an unlimited number of potential articles as they do. Basically, it seems to me that like Cid said if someone wants to fix them then fix them instead of worrying about how they're organized. Ben Sisqo 00:26, 14 Dec 2005 (UTC)
  • Oppose. See comment below. --From Andoria with Love 20:54, 16 Jan 2006 (UTC)

[edit] Memory Alpha unsorted stubs

I have an additional suggestion (which is why i reverted a preemptive edit that would have also removed all "production stubs" from the main stub list -- perhaps we should use the individual stub templates to double categorize all the stub articles -- and create the additional subcategory Memory Alpha unsorted stubs -- this way we can sort them as they accumulate, as well as having a master list.

Cases like this are why we have the suggestion page -- that category was enacted already and people had started to categorize articles into it, even though through discussion my changes could have been added. Please discuss a category first, as it is tedious, and resource consuming to have to go back and recategorize dozens or hundreds of articles. -- Captain Mike K. Barteltalk

  • Support -- Captain Mike K. Barteltalk
  • Oppose. (What happened here? I added a comment here yesterday and am sure that it went through, but now it is missing again without any sign of it in the history? Anyway... I strongly oppose any subcategorization of stubs. First, an article should only very temporarily have "stub status". Any administrative overhead used to collect, categorize and recategorize all the different stub types might better be used to "de-stub" some of them. Second, I'm not sure if it would help anyone. Right now, we have about 800 stub articles. If someone is interested in removing those right now, why doesn't he start the work? If he's not interested, would subcategorization help in any way? Third, I fear that having a detailed subcategorization scheme for stubs would only help making them a "normal" feature of MA instead of the "necessary evil" they are. -- Cid Highwind 13:10, 9 Dec 2005 (UTC)
  • Oppose. IMO, there's no need to sort what needs to be fixed rather that sorted, so get to fixing and stop worrying about sorting. --From Andoria with Love 20:54, 16 Jan 2006 (UTC)

[edit] Technologies

I suggest a list of each device/technology accompanied by its planet/civilization of origin (unless developed simultaneously by different planets, which would include the planets developing it).--Mike Nobody 04:09, 26 Oct 2005 (UTC)

This would be a list article, not a category (categories are alphabetical lists without further comments by design). Oppose as a category, but you might still want to create a "standard" article... -- Cid Highwind 13:20, 6 Jan 2006 (UTC)

[edit] From Ten Forward

I've got a category suggestion, I know there's a place for such things, but I forget where it is, feel free to move this. I'd like to see Species Unknown or something with the same meaning in order to compile the characters whose species are unknown, rather then creating pages for each one. I'm refering to the list that is starting to form under By Individual at Unnamed humanoids. Jaf 23:57, 24 Nov 2005 (UTC)

Is this the same as that suggestion for "unnamed nonhumans" below? Otherwise, could you be a little more specific about its possible content and name? -- Cid Highwind 12:25, 5 February 2006 (UTC)

[edit] Federation Members

Category:Federation Members

Self-explanatory, though I really can't decide if this should apply to species, planets, or both.--T smitts 17:26, 13 Dec 2005 (UTC)

  • Support: First of all, I would change the name to Category:Federation members, to conform to our capitalization standards. Then I would use the list at Federation members (a list of Planets) and use the Founding, Council, Other known, and Probable members sections of that page (about 33 member planets, from Aaamazzara to Zaran II). I wouldn't use anything else from that page, but we might have to categorize some species (Zaldans, Medusans, Saurians, Napeans) whose planet is unknown, or we could make a bunch of "Zaldan Homeworld" etc. pages and categorize them as Federation members.--Tim Thomason 00:08, 14 Dec 2005 (UTC)
  • Oppose, for the moment: The question whether this applies to species, planets or both is one that we already discussed about two years ago, probably on the talk page of the "Federation members" page - and although my opinion of this has changed a little since then, I still don't think there's a definite answer either way. If we can't even decide (based on canon info) if we should include one or the other, we probably shouldn't start a category. And if we do anyway, we should only include definite members, not the proabble ones. -- Cid Highwind 21:09, 27 Dec 2005 (UTC)

[edit] Inhabited Star systems?

I was looking at the star systems page earlier and it's a constantly growing page with no sub-divisions. I was wondering whether a sub-category might be appropriate for Inhabited star systems. It would list only those systems which were stated or seen to be inhabited by a known lifeform. Any system only mentioned, but not mentioned as inhabited, or any system seen but not shown to be inhabited would reside in the main category. Just seems like it would be a good way to break up the length of hte category in a helpful manner with an easy distinction. --Logan 5 01:59, 30 January 2006 (UTC)

It is usually easiest to establish a category from a reference list of some sort. Is there such a list on the site? --Alan del Beccio 02:08, 30 January 2006 (UTC)
I think we had a lengthy discussion while trying to determine exactly which planets were inhabited and which weren't some time ago - so I'd like to see a list first, too, to see if this really works. -- Cid Highwind 20:06, 1 February 2006 (UTC)

Well, there's this list: Inhabited planets which would def. be a start. It's incomplete but any planet on this list would obviously have its parent system included. Logan 5 21:44, 1 February 2006 (UTC)

So wouldnt it be easier to go with Category:Inhabited planets? --Alan del Beccio 05:21, 2 February 2006 (UTC)
My vote is for Category:Inhabited planets as well. It's more specific, and gives a finer level of detail than one for inhabited star systems. -- Renegade54 15:08, 4 February 2006 (UTC)
First, this isn't an either/or question. We might want to decide to split up the star systems category, the planets category, both or neither. If the question here is whether to split up one category, working on the other won't help at all. Going back to just the star systems category, I have to ask: Will splitting up this category really help? It has about 230 entries now, which isn't too much, and the proposed split still seems rather artificial to me - any system that was being mentioned as "inhabited" might have a striving population of billions, or just some dozen scientists on a space station in the middle of nowhere. Any other system, too, might in fact be uninhabited, or have a population that was just not mentioned. Regarding this, I don't know if a split is really worth all that, considering that we would necessarily destroy a reference page for all star systems in the process (this would also be true for the planets category, of course). Why not have categories for the generic type and list articles for any subset of that? -- Cid Highwind 15:57, 4 February 2006 (UTC)


[edit] Milky Way and Universe

In MA-fr, I created specific organisation categories rather than planets because it includes many other things. For example, Category:Qo'noS include articles about houses, klingon food, animals who are not necessarly related to the planet Qo'noS, that's why I created a more general category called "Klingon Empire", which can include Klingon starships, klingon territory (planets),... The same applies to Category:Romulus (Romulan Star Empire) and other great organisations. I think only Earth and Bajor should be categories in this manner because many entries are related to these planets. But I think they are badly categorized in Category:Planets because although they are planets, they cannot be called a subdivision of "planets" like "M-class planets". In the same way, the organizations categories I suggest ("Klingon Empire", "Dominion", "Romulan Star Empire", "UFP", "Borg Collective", "Ferengi Alliance", "Cardassian Union") are "organisations" but should not be categorized as subdivision of Category:Organizations. That's why I've created another category more general which is "Milky Way" which includes those great organisations (because Dominion, Federation, Borg Collective... cover great portion of territory in the Milky Way) and planets which big background like Earth or Bajor. Many other articles will be related to the Milky Way category : Alpha Quadrant, Galactic barrier, ... as well as the categories Planets, Category:Sectors, Category:Star systems, :Category:Cities.
Milky Way is also a subcategory of "Univers" which also includes many categories and articles like "Species", "Mirror-Universe", "Q Continuum"... - Philoust123 11:47, 27 February 2006 (UTC)

[edit] Ship categories

I think the following categories are needed:

  • Prometheus class
  • Defiant class
  • Sovereign class
  • Escort ships
  • Tactical cruisers
  • Starship technology
  • --Arado 17:50, 29 March 2006 (UTC)
  • Oppose all except Starship technology. We only have one Prometheus class, on Sovereign, and one escort. I don't even think tactical cruiser is a canon classification. As for defiant, we already have a template that links them. Jaz talk | novels 17:53, 29 March 2006 (UTC)
Where is that template?--Arado 17:56, 29 March 2006 (UTC)
{{DefiantClassStarships}} --Kobi - (Talk)
  • Oppose XXX class: since we don't have individual ship pages the articles would be over-categorised. Logical consequence is to oppose "Escort ships" and "Tactical cruisers" as well, because they could only act as super-categories -- Kobi - (Talk) 18:01, 29 March 2006 (UTC)

[edit] "Real" characters

I've created this production category on MA-fr to list all historical figures which really existed or still exist in "our" world (authors, musicians, rulers, scientist...) to distinguish them from other fictionnal characters : Bach, Berlioz, Bizet, Blair, Bradbury, Brahms, Brezhnev, Clemens, Crockett, daVinci, Dickens, Einstein, Fermat, Galilei, Gutenberg, Hawkins, Hitler, Hugo, Keats, Lenine, London, Mozart, Napoléon, Newton, Nietzsche, Pasteur, Poe, Presley, Richelieu, Shaekespeare, Sinatra, Spinoza, Verne, Wonder, Presidents of the USA... and many others - Philoust123 14:42, 11 February 2006 (UTC)

  • Mildly oppose -- I'm not sure I see the need for this meta-category. I think the fewer meta-categories the better as that distracts from the focus of this collaboration...creating a "in-universe" encyclopedia. --Alan del Beccio 17:16, 11 February 2006 (UTC)

[edit] Deep Space Stations

Category:Deep Space stations this is a minor category that can list all the Deep Space stations mentioned Deep Spaces 3,4,5,7,9, K-7 Hazzer 04:11, 01 May 2006 (UTC)

Oppose. As I said with the creation of Deep space station (see its Talk:Deep space station), we already have a category for space stations (see? :D), so I really don't see the need for this one. --From Andoria with Love 04:16, 2 May 2006 (UTC)

[edit] A Category for: Command-level programs?

I would like to see a category that groups pages like Red Alert, Saucer separation, Multi-vector assault mode, Yellow Alert, Blue Alert and Counter-insurgency program. Also, the Self-destruct program would fit into this category, along with Voyager's landing sequence etc. Basically, any program that is activated that affects the entire ship or space-station. Of course, the name of the category would take a bit of thinking about. Zsingaya 08:23, 22 March 2006 (UTC)

  • Weak oppose, do we have a list of things for this? I don't think we'd have enough, and "Command-leve" isn't quite accurate: as The Doctor, who didn't have even a level 3 (i think) level authorization was able to activate multi-vector assault mode. - AJ Halliwell 09:09, 23 July 2006 (UTC)

[edit] Earth sub-categories

[edit] Earth transportation

[edit] Earth Regions

[edit] POSSIBLE CATAGORY

A superb addition would be a columned list showing words/names used, their historical origin and the episode in which they were used.

EXAMPLE: 

         NAME                           HISTORICAL ORIGIN                    EPISODE

        SARGON                        SARGON II, KING OF ASSYRIA           "RETURN TO TOMORROW"
                                      722-705 B.C.

        BALOK                         MEMBER OF BRITISH HOUSE OF           "THE CORBOMITE MANEUVER"
                                      COMMONS (CONTEMPORARY OF WINSTON
                                      S. CHURCHILL
That can't be done with a category. --OuroborosCobra talk 04:38, 7 January 2007 (UTC)
your possible category is impossible. figure that out... i really don't like the concept anyways. --6/6 Neural Transceiver 23:54, 7 January 2007 (UTC)
Hey, no need to sound mean. I already told him it was impossible. There is no need to respond "it is impossible, figure that out". It makes it sound like the anon has not already learned that. You have no evidence of that. They have not responded since I first politely told them it was impossible. --OuroborosCobra talk 01:05, 8 January 2007 (UTC)

[edit] A-Z

Creating a Category:A-Z that will include all pages, only properly sorted like Sisko, Benjamin. I first saw this at the BSG wiki, and thought it was stupid, but after some thought, I am starting to like it.

Here are the pros in contrast to Special:AllPages:

  • It would be a true alphabetical index; all the pages would be sorted correctly using category sort keys. We have a lot of names and common articles/prefixes like "The" and "USS" and "IKS".
  • Only actual pages would be listed, not redirects or hack pages like %s.
  • It would be easier to browse, using the category TOC template.

Also:

  • The bot can implement it fairly easily, using already existing template info on each page.

--Bp 04:42, 16 December 2006 (UTC)

Oppose. I really don't see the benefit to having this page. I do not think that it is going to be used, and therefore there is not much reason in my mind to have it. Also, it makes something else for new members and such to have to remember when creating articles. I just do not see a good reason to do this. --OuroborosCobra talk 04:49, 16 December 2006 (UTC)
Some of the "cons" that come to mind:
  • Would make the "Uncategorized articles" special page completely useless.
  • Would add another step to article creation, or alternatively
  • Would need regular bot runs to see which pages still need to be categorized here
  • Would be much work for something that, I believe, is not terribly useful. If I know I'm looking for Benjamin Sisko, I wouldn't use an Alphabetical index - neither "B" nor "S".
    • In a heavily hyperlinked database like this, an alphabetical index of all pages is the least useful way of n

avigation, anyway.

So, regarding all this, I don't think such a category would really be useful - but perhaps I'm missing something? -- Cid Highwind 13:08, 17 December 2006 (UTC)

[edit] MA Campaigns

I think there should be provisionnal categories for specific campaigns :
Unnamed people : For example, looking for all the unnamed people on a serie. I presume that a bot can put this campaign category on all the episodes of TNG for example. In that case, when someone is watching a TNG episode, he knows he should look carefully at the unnamed people to see if they are all listed. After adding the unlisted one, he then removes this category. At the end, when this category is empty, the campaign is over and we know for sure, that all this people are listed, because for the moment, we don't know which episodes are ckecked or not. - Philoust123 15:19, 20 March 2006 (UTC)

Well, we'd only know that for each episode there's someone who believes that he found all possible "unnamed people" (or whatever it is we're looking for at the moment, and that's not even counting mild vandalism by simply removing these tags unchecked). However, these might be useful tools, but on the other hand, I really don't want to see yet another message template or admin category on an article ("oppose"), and if this proposal goes through, I think we all now well that it won't stop at one or two of those categories. What about restricting this to the episode talk pages, I'd support that? That way, someone who wants to take part in this campaign can find episodes just as easily while there won't be an additional distracting message for someone who actually just wants to read about the episode... -- Cid Highwind 10:20, 11 May 2006 (UTC)
Oppose. I really don't think any of this would be necessary. --From Andoria with Love 07:41, 5 November 2006 (UTC)

[edit] Category:Memory Alpha episode templates

Not my suggestion, but taken from Category talk:Templates:

-- Cid Highwind 18:51, 16 August 2006 (UTC)

Support! (at least the first 3) -- Renegade54 19:18, 16 August 2006 (UTC)
  • Mental note: It should be noted that we have quite a few unused templates that are just lounging around that should be saved or tossed at some point--Alan del Beccio 01:30, 25 August 2006 (UTC)
First three categories apparently accepted, discussion as of this point copied to Category talk:Memory Alpha templates. Keeping this here to further discuss the final suggestion. -- Cid Highwind 10:32, 26 August 2006 (UTC)

[edit] Image categories by episode (created, about 700)

Categories such as Memory Alpha images (SER - Episode Title)
These could be used to create image categories/galleries for individual episodes - for example by adding these category links to a new image template, like done here: {{imagescreenshot}}. Something like this has been requested on IRC and here: Memory Alpha:Bot requests. -- Cid Highwind 14:41, 31 December 2006 (UTC)

[edit] Templates

That's an idea for a category page (If it does not already exist...) where templates can be listed, ranging from starship pages, to people pages, to templates used throughout MA for various reasons. In sort a list of the templates on MA.--Terran Officer 05:40, 8 January 2007 (UTC)

I think we are already doing that over at Category:Memory Alpha templates, which is at least somewhat further subdivided into templates based upon use (like Category:Memory Alpha navigational templates). --OuroborosCobra talk 05:45, 8 January 2007 (UTC)

[edit] Artists

Category:Production artists

Another sub-category of Category:Production staff for such people as artists, whether book covers, comics, or set decoration. -- Sulfur 12:18, 1 August 2006 (UTC)

Comment: This might be better suited as its own seperate category if its going to be for books and the like, as those products are seperate from those officially licensed by Paramount Pictures and therefore not involving the production staff from the shows or films. --From Andoria with Love 07:15, 2 August 2006 (UTC)

The other possibility there is to have a couple of "artist" categories, one for books, comics, etc (which are still officially licensed by Paramount), and one for the set decorators, painters, etc. Regardless, we do need one for artists, we have a right stack of them now. -- Sulfur 11:58, 2 August 2006 (UTC)

[edit] Technical Difficulties

Category:Technical Difficulties would just be a place for pages like Warp_core_breach, Hull breach, and Neutron fatigue to call home. With all the technobabble and problems the Enterprise(s), Voyager, Defiant, and Deep Space 9 run into, I don't see how this wouldn't be a full category. --6/6 Neural Transceiver 07:45, 11 December 2006 (UTC)

I do support a category for such events, but I'm not crazy about the name... unfortunately, I currently have no ideas for another name... --